Especially since both of those quotes were taken from the philosophies of the surrounding cultures of the time and were not central to Jewish or Christian thought.
although it's worth remembering that these were chosen precisely because they're everyday sayings, so it's not really a representative sample. i'd wager the vast majority of people wouldn't know the vast majority of bible quotes, and most lines of the bible are not influential in the slightest.
You'd be surprised how influential a book can be when there was a good thousand years of time where you can get put to death for not being influenced by it.
I feel sorry for you who deny God and His teachings, because when He calls you, and you stand at the gates of Heaven, but are denied entrance, you will beg to be let in, but it will be too late. If you want to be truly happy, then stop denying the truth!
This is where I get irritated with religion as it is so judgemental. I judge no one for their beliefs but when they tell me I have to believe in what they believe it is sheer arrogance. I went to a funeral the other day in an Anglican church and instead of honouring the man who died the preacher went on and on about that if you do not believe in JC then you are lost and with hope. my wife, who is jewish, was visibly offended by the repeated claims that we are without hope and sadly left that funeral with a large degree of sadness for lack of respect shown for the man who passed away and the almost anger at anyone who did not believe in JC. Shame on that man.
Yeah, that doesn't make any sense. If it's not his fault how come you can see the truth and he can't?
because you're blessed with some special insight or resistance to the devil that s/he isn't?
Or is it that you are exercising your free will in the service of god unlike most other people who have ever lived? Again that makes you a pretty special person and way better than all the people who refuse to do the same.
This is what gets me is the fundamental claim that believers have to make in order to defend faith positions that cannot be demonstrated outside of their own minds.
I've wondered about why Christianity has become so judging and see as so. I've thought about how ideally, Christianity should be one of the least judgmental religions.
Not because it's lenient and we should do whatever we want, but because Jesus and the Bible as a whole made it a very clear point that we are all sinful and hopeless to the exact same degree(Plank in your own eye). None of us have the authority to judge. All sin as a whole is detestable to God. None of us deserve the salvation we've been offered.
I don't think it's a Christian thing, but a power thing. I live in a predominantly Christian society — presumably you do too. Every religious group and even irreligious groups have been judgemental if not outright oppressive to others when they hold a lot of power, at least at some point: Christians in medieval Europe, Muslims in Iran, Buddhists in Myanmar, Hindus in India, atheists in the Soviet Union…
I personally think of religion as a resource, which can be used in the service of good or in the service of evil. All people are fallible. Malicious individuals can preach judgemental misrepresentations of the Bible, and some believers with good intentions will lap it up due to human error.
Most Protestant denominations believe in the doctrine of "grace alone", Sola gratia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sola_gratia
According to this doctrine, no one "deserves" to go to heaven, so there's nothing one can possibly do to earn admittance. The only reason that one can be admitted is by divine grace.
So, in many cases, the judgmental people are not only being jerks, they are also simply wrong about church doctrine.
This comment disgusts me. In my personal belief, you do not have to believe to be let into Heaven. The knowledge of religion is there to guide us to become good people- not to say how if you don't believe the same thing, you are an evil person. And the same goes for Christians. In my opinion, believing won't get you into heaven. Instead, being a good person who benefits the world in total will. So instead of going around insulting non-Christians, please use your religion to become a good person.
Totally agree. When the Bible talks about judgement, it implies that it is out of our hands and that we, as humans, don't have a right to judge other people. What the Bible says that we can do is show justice and mercy to others, regardless of race or class or gender or creed.
As Jiaozira says below though, the most vocal proponents of religions/ideologies are typically their most extreme, which leads to distortions of what the true meanings of those religions/ideologies. Unfortunately, this means that people have an idea of Christianity always being super conservative, and that the voices of more liberal Christians like me and ClutchNferno often get sidelined. Although I'm hoping that will change, especially because Joe Biden is pretty liberal and has been outspoken about his faith.
John 3:16-18 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.
Why are people boasting about getting high scores if they are atheists? Why are you so pleased about getting such high scores if you believe none of it's true? What is the point in taking this quiz if you don't believe any of it, or actually trying to remember the verses?
Mainly because the characters and quotations are easier to remember than those in Lord of the Rings. Seriously though, I pity you. Why must one be a Christian to know about the Bible? Do I need to be Muslim to know about, or be curious about the Qur'an?
Do people choose not to believe in God? I don't think that what you believe is your choice as such. Your conjecture might be true other than that occasionally, but I can't think of many cases where that leads to very vocalised or passionate atheism. More likely I would imagine it would lead to just not going to church. Most atheists who will talk about it willingly are atheists just because there is no evidence that any god exists.
While that might be true for some atheists, I can assure you that, as far as I'm concerned, my atheism has nothing to do with the church. I like churches (the buildings), and I like religious ritual (it looks like fun dress-up, and there's usually parties afterwards). Like any institutions, churches do some good, and some bad. On balance, I think the world would be better off without churches, but there's also some wonderful people that are part of them and use them to do good. None of this has anything to do with my atheism, which comes down to two things: lack of evidence for god, and lack of a coherent logical claim about god. That's really it.
I can't speak for all atheists, but I was raised without religion. The only times I've been dragged to church were for weddings and funerals.
For me, I continue to choose atheism for a number of reasons.
The first is that I simply haven't heard a good reason for why I should believe that a book written by people contains the words of the creator of everything. Even if I were to join a church for other reasons, I'm not sure a fake-believer would be wanted.
Next, the emotional argument. Christians trying to convert me often talk about being embraced by Jesus's love — and while I appreciate this more than those who try to convert me through fear, I do not have the same starting point of being raised to believe Jesus is divine. I can get love from many places, and while the kindness in Jesus's teachings is very moving, joining a church for this reason would leave it outweighed by the discomfort I'd get for other reasons. Thankfully, I don't need to be Christian to appreciate his words.
The fear arguments (specifically the "if I'm wrong, nothing happens; if you're wrong, you go to Hell" argument) did actually affect me a bit — never enough to push me to try Christianity out, but it did leave me worried on particularly bad nights. But a couple years ago I came across a similar sort of argument about AI of all things, and the refutation was applicable to God too: there are infinite ways God could choose who to save versus who to punish, and there is by definition no way for any of us to know which way is true. There's no rule saying that God MUST give directions for salvation to the people. Maybe you need to follow all of Jesus's teachings without straying once. Maybe you just need to like Jesus. Maybe you need to eat raviolis every week and nothing else matters. From this point of view, when it comes to securing salvation, the Bible — like every teaching from every religion — is worthless.
The last argument I want to talk about — which has been by far the most appealing to me — is that of community. People are very isolated these days, at least in my society, and coming together to build community bonds once a week sounds pretty neat. It sounds like something that would be good for me.
When it comes to religion, though, this community comes with rules and responsibilities. While less devoted communities like clubs provide less community, they come with much fewer demands. I already struggle with my responsibilities, so I'm not too keen on adding religious responsibilities on top of that.
And like I said at the beginning, I'm not sure real Christians would be very happy with a fraud like me joining for community and love, all while not believing in the divinity of Jesus or the existence of God.
You're welcome to reply with anything you think I've overlooked, if you want to. I'm unlikely to remember to check back here, though.
That's not factually correct. You probably know very many atheists, they're just not vocal or in your face about it. They would probably say so if you had a conversation on religion (or perhaps not..there are many "closet atheists" that don't feel comfortable sharing their beliefs for a variety of reasons. There are certainly very vocal atheists, just as there are vocal proponents of practically every belief (feminism, christianity, etc).
Unfortunately it is the most vocal members of each group, whose words travel the furthest and paint a bad picture of the rest of us (be it Christianity, atheism, feminism, political ideology, etc.)
As opposed to religious people, who are usually so quiet and discreet about it. I mean, look at all those monuments to atheism in every city in the world. Look at all those atheists thanking atheism after a sports event, or reciting atheisms in public. Look at all those atheists wearing special magic necklaces, or pieces of clothing, to show their atheism. Must be sooo annoying to not be an atheist in this world, when you get atheism shoved in your face all day everywhere!
I thought for SURE “eat, drink, and be merry” was Shakespeare! Didn’t the Bible say something about eating, drinking, and then being *fruitful*? Ah hell, maybe THAT was Shakespeare;-)
It's more important to you. Personally, I find knowledge of religions as a literary, historical and social phenomenon much more useful than "faith", which is by definition a suspension of logical thinking.
Really great quiz! I knew most of the answers, but got stuck on the 'house divided against itself' I kept thinking of Abraham Lincoln and couldn't think of the word haha. Really good quiz. The Bible is exploding with wisdom and love!
"Eternal Damnation", as I was taught, does not mean eternal suffering in hell fire or some other form of intense punishment; it simply means being condemned to remain dead once you die. The dead are aware of nothing, feel nothing. know nothing. Therefore, it is ludicrous to think that they will suffer in hell fire. To many believers, the prospect of not being resurrected is punishment enough to impel them to live as righteous a life as we imperfect mortals can..
When I was a little girl I asked my dad where I was before I was born and he told me I was out chasing rabbits. I'd choose heaven over that any day. :)
Or, if you are a Muslim, read Seeking Allah, Finding Jesus, or watch the video. Its about a devout Muslim who becomes a Christian after critically examining both the Bible and the Qur'an.
Considering the Catholic Church, the largest organized religious institution in the history of humanity, is directly responsible for a huge amount of scientific achievements, and many Catholics are great scientists, think Isaac Newton or Georges Lemaitre, this idea that religion is inherently anti science is just garbage.
Can "sinless" be counted for "without sin"? I don't use KJV (I have read from 3-4 other versions), so I would have gotten that had I known the difference in versions.
because you're blessed with some special insight or resistance to the devil that s/he isn't?
Or is it that you are exercising your free will in the service of god unlike most other people who have ever lived? Again that makes you a pretty special person and way better than all the people who refuse to do the same.
This is what gets me is the fundamental claim that believers have to make in order to defend faith positions that cannot be demonstrated outside of their own minds.
@ChaosLord great job on making a very weak argument against christianity
Not because it's lenient and we should do whatever we want, but because Jesus and the Bible as a whole made it a very clear point that we are all sinful and hopeless to the exact same degree(Plank in your own eye). None of us have the authority to judge. All sin as a whole is detestable to God. None of us deserve the salvation we've been offered.
I personally think of religion as a resource, which can be used in the service of good or in the service of evil. All people are fallible. Malicious individuals can preach judgemental misrepresentations of the Bible, and some believers with good intentions will lap it up due to human error.
Why would you want to follow a guy like that? Out of fear I guess, so actually I feel sorry for you for being in this sadist's thrall
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sola_gratia
According to this doctrine, no one "deserves" to go to heaven, so there's nothing one can possibly do to earn admittance. The only reason that one can be admitted is by divine grace.
So, in many cases, the judgmental people are not only being jerks, they are also simply wrong about church doctrine.
As Jiaozira says below though, the most vocal proponents of religions/ideologies are typically their most extreme, which leads to distortions of what the true meanings of those religions/ideologies. Unfortunately, this means that people have an idea of Christianity always being super conservative, and that the voices of more liberal Christians like me and ClutchNferno often get sidelined. Although I'm hoping that will change, especially because Joe Biden is pretty liberal and has been outspoken about his faith.
Or maybe I'm simply well versed in phrases that have absolutely become cliches. It's almost sad, really.
Alice in Wonderland and that's not true
grew to so hate the ritual that they chose atheism as adults. I
am also opposed to the blasphemy of many religious rituals,
but it does not lead me to deny the existence of the Almighty.
For me, I continue to choose atheism for a number of reasons.
The first is that I simply haven't heard a good reason for why I should believe that a book written by people contains the words of the creator of everything. Even if I were to join a church for other reasons, I'm not sure a fake-believer would be wanted.
Next, the emotional argument. Christians trying to convert me often talk about being embraced by Jesus's love — and while I appreciate this more than those who try to convert me through fear, I do not have the same starting point of being raised to believe Jesus is divine. I can get love from many places, and while the kindness in Jesus's teachings is very moving, joining a church for this reason would leave it outweighed by the discomfort I'd get for other reasons. Thankfully, I don't need to be Christian to appreciate his words.
When it comes to religion, though, this community comes with rules and responsibilities. While less devoted communities like clubs provide less community, they come with much fewer demands. I already struggle with my responsibilities, so I'm not too keen on adding religious responsibilities on top of that.
And like I said at the beginning, I'm not sure real Christians would be very happy with a fraud like me joining for community and love, all while not believing in the divinity of Jesus or the existence of God.
You're welcome to reply with anything you think I've overlooked, if you want to. I'm unlikely to remember to check back here, though.
Sure, sure, I know someone will shout "context!!!" but it's still pretty funny.
I don't know what minority you are referring to.